[PsyBorg]

Does the rule about "you must use Time Attack when possible" apply to Single/3 Lap? I noticed in the SR videos that Time Attack mode isn't used and GP mode is used instead.

[Bilan]

Use whichever you want, but you wont get good times if you play in TA mode.

[PsyBorg]

Thanks. I'll be off to trying for the Resort Island (Single Lap) record now.

[IceHedge]

You can nearly half the times in Grand Prix as opposed to Time Attack.  Why is Sonic R so special that it doesn't matter? 

I'm not questioning your expertise here since you're more accustomed to the site, but it seems odd that I can just wait until I'm in last on any stage, resume a lap, and get running shoes and use the speed booster to beat a (lap) record ftw.

[SprintGod]

Apparently the Saturn version saves times without regard to the modes used.

Just bug Rolken about it until he adds separate Time Attack and Reverse divisions. I've brought it up a few times but nothing's been done as of yet.

Separate character submissions would be nice as well...

[yse]

Separate character submissions would be nice as well...

I must be the only person that disagrees with you on this one.

As you've mentioned, having all characters represented results in 400 divisions. Since strategies won't alter significantly between characters, it seems rather worthless to me.

[IceHedge]

400 divisions?  I'll try to break it down.

Characters are as follows:  Sonic, Tails, Knuckles, Amy, Shado--*shot*, Robotnik, MS, MK, Tails Doll, Egg Robo, Super Sonic

That's 10 characters total from memory.  The other divisions would be as follows:  Grand Prix, Time Attack Normal, Time Attack Reverse, Balloons, and Tag. 

That's 5 other divisions.  The stages are as follows:  Resort Island, Radical City, Regal Ruin, Reactive Factory, Radiant Emerald.

That's 5 stages.  5 * 5 * 10 = 250.  There would be 250 divisions, but who really needs Tag and Balloons anyway?

Still, Super Sonic is the character to use when making records, and since for some reason people are saying it's ok to use Grand Prix mode to make records, it all seems unbalanced to me.  And correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought the Saturn version was identical to the PC and Gamecube version except for the fact that the PC/GCN has weather effects.  Records-wise, it's the same.

*shot again for being such a prick about it*  XP

[Taillow]

You forgot one thing.  Grand prix, time attack, and reverse have single and three lap times

So the formula is:

[(3 X 2) + 2] X 5 X 10 = 400

[Bilan]

While 400 divisions would indeed be insane, I wouldn't mind maybe 3/4 characters as opposed to just "Super Sonic".

Maybe Amy, as she's unique due to her boosts, and one of the Mecha characters and one of the 'Fleshies'?

Also mike you say the strats wont alter, try Radical City with Amy/anyone that cant jump :P

[PsyBorg]

I think seperate character divisions would be nice as well, as Super Sonic only kinda sucks, but of course, too many characters= too many rankings.

These are the only solutions I can think of:

Jumpers/Non-Jumpers/Super Sonic
Non-Mecha/Mecha/Super Sonic
Super Sonic/Other


We have narrowed it down to 8 X 5 X 3 or 2, equaling 120 or 80. It's a tough decision to make as to how we would add more characters without ranking overflow, though.

[Bilan]

Branding characters into 'jumpers', 'non jumpers' and 'other' classes is just stupid.

Those divisions then become (In the order I listed them)

"Mecha Knuckles" "Eggrobo" and "Mecha Knuckles".

[PsyBorg]

Branding characters into 'jumpers', 'non jumpers' and 'other' classes is just stupid.

Those divisions then become (In the order I listed them)

"Mecha Knuckles" "Eggrobo" and "Mecha Knuckles".

Well, we are trying to think of a way to make some form of a non-Super Sonic section. Do you have anything to contribute? Maybe I'll like your idea better.

[Bilan]

Branding characters into 'jumpers', 'non jumpers' and 'other' classes is just stupid.

Those divisions then become (In the order I listed them)

"Mecha Knuckles" "Eggrobo" and "Mecha Knuckles".

Well, we are trying to think of a way to make some form of a non-Super Sonic section. Do you have anything to contribute? Maybe I'll like your idea better.

...

While 400 divisions would indeed be insane, I wouldn't mind maybe 3/4 characters as opposed to just "Super Sonic".

Maybe Amy, as she's unique due to her boosts, and one of the Mecha characters and one of the 'Fleshies'?

Also mike you say the strats wont alter, try Radical City with Amy/anyone that cant jump :P

[Marth]

A Time Attack division would be nice, and Reverse is better than Balloons or Tag in my opinion.
Characters wouldn't be a good idea, unless (like RPGnutter and PsyBorg suggested)
just a few characters were chosen. It's hard to divide them into groups, so maybe it could just be
Super Sonic / Sonic / Robotnik      or something.
The Tails doll is better than the other non-jumping characters, and it can hover, but
it's not actually a jumping character. The robots can glide over water, so Metal Sonic
and Metal Knuckles are basically just slow versions of Super Sonic.

I was wondering about the speed shoes. They are allowed?
(I've been careful not to use them.)

[Bilan]

Yep, there allowed

[SprintGod]

"Too many divisions" is a nonissue. It's not as though anyones forcing you to submit for everything.

[douglas]

I disagree; when the challenge is essentially the same for two different characters the redundancy is irritating and it takes longer to topple champions, which means less incentive for competition.

[SprintGod]

1. Not all divisions have to contribute to rankings.
2. The most popular game on the site has 300+ tracked records.

[yse]

2. The most popular game on the site has 300+ tracked records.

300 divisions that aren't the same thing ten times over... You're just artificially creating divisions for the sake of it.

[IceHedge]

I'm often slow at calculating every bit of the details in arguments(hey, not all arguments are offensive), so thanks for correcting me, Quartz.

I'm glad others agree that something should be done about the characters.  I still don't understand why Grand Prix counts towards regular lap & course times, but whatever.  A positive note is that strategically using the speed shoes in conjunction with the shortcuts can be tricky to topple leaders, so it adds some competition.

For now, we just need the correct TA, Reverse, and whatever mode that isn't as popular as regular time crunchers.  While I enjoy Balloons and Tag, I guess they wouldn't be taken seriously in rankings.

I still can't think of anything for individual character times though.

[SprintGod]

2. The most popular game on the site has 300+ tracked records.

300 divisions that aren't the same thing ten times over... You're just artificially creating divisions for the sake of it.

I already addressed the supposed problem of repetition two posts ago:
"It's not as though anyones forcing you to submit for everything."
Besides which, I'm not 'artificially creating' anything. You are choosing to completely ignore the existence of divisions already established within the game.

The point you quoted and completely missed the context of was in response to douglas' point about toppling champions. I don't see anyone demanding the deletion of any SA2B divisions because it's taking too long for them to become champion.

There is no argument as to whether or not they should be added. It's quite simple: The game tracks them, so they need to be added. You seem to be completely confusing the issue of whether they should be added with how they should affect the rankings.

The obvious way of doing it is to only count Super Sonic's times. An extension of this could be to include various Totals of the other characters.

[douglas]

All I was trying to say was that, taking Advance 2 as an example, in order to beat me someone would have to be well up there in Times and Bosses BUT ALSO play each level through 5 times for rings (if each run is perfect, which obviously isn't the case) for rings/scores, where the challenge is pretty much the same for each character.

I like the sound of having different divisions for each character but then only counting the fastest towards  the championship; I reckon it'd be nice (if that were taken up) if we had some obvious way of seeing which divisions 'count' (like have them highlighted or sommat).

Meh, I'm not sure.  Just thinking aloud to be honest.

[Crowbar]

D'you basically mean that, contrary to what Sprint is saying, you would be forced to submit for everything if you really wanted to compete seriously, and that with so many divisions it'd be more than anybody would want to do?

editzomg100posts

[IceHedge]

D'you basically mean that, contrary to what Sprint is saying, you would be forced to submit for everything if you really wanted to compete seriously, and that with so many divisions it'd be more than anybody would want to do?

editzomg100posts

I agree with Sprint's last post.  As for the issue with the mastery of multiple divisions, I'll refer back to other titles. The absense of ring rankings could prove there aren't that many completionists out there to put forth the effort to go through with Sonic R.  Not many people upload ring rankings, so rings may be as important as Balloons or Tag in Sonic R's sake, but it should still be implemented in recorded rankings.

[SprintGod]

Sonic R has infinite rings per stage.

[Bilan]

This is true

[PsyBorg]

Yeah, now that I think about it, you don't NEED to submit for everything. I'd discuss further but /me needs to watch a movie now, so I'll leave this here until I say something more later.

[Taillow]

No, wait.  I see where Sprint's getting at here.

There is no argument as to whether or not they should be added. It's quite simple: The game tracks them, so they need to be added. You seem to be completely confusing the issue of whether they should be added with how they should affect the rankings.

The obvious way of doing it is to only count Super Sonic's times. An extension of this could be to include various Totals of the other characters.

That would make submitting times for most other characters voluntary rather than mandatory to compete well.

[IceHedge]

D'you basically mean that, contrary to what Sprint is saying, you would be forced to submit for everything if you really wanted to compete seriously, and that with so many divisions it'd be more than anybody would want to do?

editzomg100posts

I agree with Sprint's last post.  As for the issue with the mastery of multiple divisions, I'll refer back to other titles. The absense of ring rankings could prove there aren't that many completionists out there to put forth the effort to go through with Sonic R.  Not many people upload ring rankings, so rings may be as important as Balloons or Tag in Sonic R's sake, but it should still be implemented in recorded rankings.

What I meant by 'absence of ring rankings' was that not many people upload ring rankings in any other Sonic game.  There aren't ring rankings in Sonic R because you can get an infinite amount of up to 999, I know that.  XP

Point being there shouldn't be too many people complaining if all divisions for each character are uploaded, since there aren't many people uploading ranks for all the divisions(I refer back to teh ring rankings as an example).

[Bilan]

Ill be filling in every bracket <_<